05.01.2011 01:00 PM

I’m guessing Jim Curran…

…is going to have a thing or two to say about this.


  1. John B says:

    And you Warren? What do you think about it? And what do you think will actually happen? Your readers surely would like to know that you’ve posted the link.

  2. John B says:

    typo: Your readers surely would like to know NOW that you’ve posted the link.

  3. George says:

    I’m thinking that the rest of the LPOC, especially the grass root supporters might have something to say about this. I sure as hell hope they do anyway.

  4. James Curran says:

    When you dignify an answer of this question on the last day of the campaign I believe you concede defeat.

    But in answer to the statement at hand…in the words of a Canadian songster….


  5. Paul R Martin says:

    I would think that the party would tell him to go. Furthermore, there is no guarantee that Etobicoke Lakeshore will return Iggy to Parliament.

  6. Bill M. says:

    Nobody would say they’d leave before the results are in.

  7. fritz says:

    COMPAS has a new poll out. It predicts a Tory majority.
    46% Tory
    26% NDP
    17% Lib
    7% BQ
    6% Green
    I think they must be polling some fantasy election that Gord and other Tories are watching. 🙂

    • Al in Cranbrook says:

      What’s interesting about this poll, despite its relatively small sampling, is the degree of fluidity, particularly with NDP support. Based on their studies, they conclude that actual votes cast for the NDP could range from as low as 20% to as high as 36%. This is based in part on the finding that only 39% of declared NDP supporters could name the candidate in their riding…which is somewhat scary when you think about it. They surmise, rightly or wrongly, that people who can’t even be bothered to know who their local candidate is, probably aren’t too serious about showing up to vote, either. I suspect there’s some truth to this. (Recall the hundreds of thousands who were going to show up at massive demonstrations over prorogation…and the couple hundred who actually did.)

      I’m increasingly of a mind that, when this all done, some pollsters (and pundits, too) are going to have some ‘splainin’ to do.

      (Nevertheless, I converted most of my stocks to cash last week…the NDP somehow manage to win this thing, the TSX is going to be an unholy slaughter Tuesday!)

      • sunsin says:

        Why is failure to know the name of the candidate in a riding scary? We vote for parties in Canada, not personalities. It would be better to judge political maturity by asking a voter to characterize the positions of the three parties on key issues.

      • Thanks for buying tip, Al. The TSX will not budge a point if the NDP wins. Did the sky fall in Manitoba or Nova Scotia? The NDP are social democrats, not Pol Pot. But nice scare tactic. How about a YouTube clip of Brinks trucks crossing the border to the US? I’m sure your comrades at the National Post or Sun TV could make it happen…

        • fritz says:

          I did the same as Al a few months ago, but not because I was worried about the NDP taking over. I’m afraid those crazy Tea Party types in the US will screw up and not raise the US debt limit in time and thus their economy (and ours) will collapse. 😉

    • Paul R Martin says:

      I read their results with interest. In their opinion, voting intentions are very volatile. They do say that Conservative support is the most committed. Of the voters who actually know the name of the candidate they plan to vote for, 50% plan to vote Conservative. They do say that NDP support could rise to 36% or it could fall to 20%.

  8. Robin says:

    Well, he does have first hand experience with the problems stabbing a leader in the back can cause. The question is, will any of the knife wielders listen when he tells them what a mistake it was when he was in their shoes?

  9. Donna says:

    You guys even know the meaning of the word loyalty? You couldn’t hold off until the polls closed before you try and publicly annihilate your leader??? Ignatieff has worked harder and shown more passion for this country than the other leaders combined. He’s had to contend not only with the Tory smear campaign, but now yours as well. News flash gentlemen. All across this country Liberals have come to know, like and respect their leader. Just try and dump him!

    • allegra fortissima says:


      • James Curran says:

        Loyalty begets loyalty. Think about what you’re saying. It’s a cold reality in the leadership jungle. I didn’t bring this topic up, but Iggy sure did leave the door open for all of us to be talking about this today. His answer should of been “I don’t deal in hypotheticals. I am the leader of the Liberal Party of Canada and on Tuesday morning we will be forming government” Instead he left the door wide open.

        • Donna says:

          Maybe it’s time YOU thought about what you’re saying. He left the door wide open? And you had to just rush right in? Pure arrogance.

          • James Curran says:

            The arrogance was not mine. The arrogance is his. This is the same guy that knew we all wanted to get rid of Dion and we all didn’t want to elect a Rae or a Leblanc. The same guy that foisted himself as leader by caucus vote rather than putting it to the party. That’s arrogance.

        • Philip says:

          You do what you feel you have to do. I’m supporting Ignatieff in any leadership convention with everything I have. Ignatieff manned up and took a two year shit kicking from the Conservative Party operatives. He knew it was coming and took it without flinching and then ran one hell of a campaign. Not many men could have done that and walked tall through it all. When I was in the Canadian Forces we had a two word definition of leadership: “Follow me”. I think I’ll follow Ignatieff’s example.
          Your mileage may vary.

          • Craig Chamberlain says:

            Sounds like we have a ball game.

          • Philip says:

            LOL! It will be an interesting summer anyway.

          • James Curran says:

            Didn’t Dion do that? Oh, but his English was bad. That’s right.

          • Craig Chamberlain says:

            Dion’s English was bad, which made his chosen task of selling the Green Shift… painful. And to learn after the fact his own polling showed that, and he continued on, suggests among other things a degree of hubris on his part. Still, I always admired his commitment to Liberal values and his high esteem of Canadians.

        • Jan says:

          For the love of God, can’t you wait until after the election for this crap. I’m still debating whether to vote for Renee Heatherington or Elizabeth May. This talk is turning me off voting Liberal.

  10. Craig Chamberlain says:

    I happen to recall a Liberal leader in Ontario that held on after losing his first election, only to win a big majority in his second. And of a federal NDP leader that has “lost” a few elections but seems to be doing well now. But all of this is moot. We haven’t had the election yet!

    • James Curran says:

      NOne of those leaders lead a coup against the previous leader to becom leader themselves though did they? Anyhow, I’m with Warren. He ran a superior campaign to any other national leader. The damage was done 2 years ago and it couldn’t be fixed in a 36 day campaign.

      • Craig Chamberlain says:

        Yes, and so with this election, haven’t we essentially flushed the toilet when it comes to the accumulated CCRAP attack ad crap on Ignatieff?

      • Ron says:

        I have to ask this question…why wasn’t it fixed earlier.
        I stated this earlier in the week…they saw the attack ads on Dion and knew / then saw the one’s on Iggy…
        Where were the counter ads…not necessarily attack ads…more like rebuttals

        Just asking for your thoughts

        • Michael says:

          It all comes down to money.

          The reason the Conservatives were able to run the attack ads was because they were awash in cash.

          The Liberals could not afford to respond with ads of their own.

          Apparently during this election they have seen a marked increase in donations ($4M) and a marked increase in volunteers. That is what they need to concentrate on and build up if they hope to get elected again.

          And all of you speaking of a merger with the NDP are just nervous nellies. 😉

          • Ron says:

            So do they “tear it all down” and build from the grass roots?
            I believe it is the right thing to do…but they have to stand for something of substance

          • Craig Chamberlain says:


  11. Cath says:

    This is WAY off topic Warren but it reminded me of that Epic KD thread you had going here about a year ago I think it was.
    This video kicks about as much ass as you do sometimes.


  12. R says:


    the photo of Ottawa citizen showed or means lik this:

    end result liberal and conservative is goint to enter in coaltion and 3years harper then he will leave and 3 years Igiantiff will continue and he will get our UN seat back and he will replace with new bigger after this term finished by join majority of accept liberal plat form for mainly english Canadian supportor
    focus is to economic development

    and coaltion of quebec french people area with jack layton and Decep as coaltion for oppsotion

    back to civil war untill all Canada get united

  13. Craig Chamberlain says:

    Ignatieff was asked a question. He answered it. Just as he has all through this election. That is his style. He was right to stick to it.

  14. Cath says:

    First Quebec then…………..Orange takes on the world. This is a funny post by a Tory blogger.

    Let’s face it – this has got to go down in history as the weirdest election EVER.

    • Ian says:

      OMG, sustainable economy, ending monopoly, struggle for peace and ending poverty!!!! They’ll force us to wear orange clothing, and our children will be nationalized!

      Is this a joke, or are these people seriously freaking out? The comments seem to take it seriously.

  15. Bart F. says:

    Am a con supporter but my two cents on this would be that it’s a good place for the Liberals to start.

    Warren’s HOAG theory is only a partial explanation. Many people also think with the other side of their brains. Iggy is not that bad a day to day campaigner. Three suggestions for the Liberals:

    1. Stick with Ignatieff for now. I think he comes across as a reasonable public speaker and he is obviously very bright.

    2. Have Ignatieff “happy up” his persona a bit. Us conservatives are supposed to be the angry people.

    3. Move your ideological color back to the center.

    • bigcitylib says:

      I would agree with this as a general principle. But if tomorrow is a freaking disaster, which seems likely, I’m sorry but people shouldn’t get to screw up that badly and keep their job.

  16. Bill From Willowdale says:

    Until Dion, Liberal leaders got two elections to win government. Guess people are impatient now.

    • The other George says:

      Bill’s right you know.

      So many people are parroting the media line of Iggy not being the guy to have beers with and this is important to people. When I ask around, nobody gives a rats a** about having a beer with the PM. They want somebody who is going to look after their interest.

      I personally feel that Iggy has shown us his chops. It has been a good campaign and, if there is a poor showing, it will reflect more of an unusual push for Jack rather than a thumbs down on Iggy. If anything, this gives the Liberals a chance to rethink, wove more to the left and rebrand with Iggy at the helm.

      One thing I would reflect on is the fact that throughout all these so called polls and their fluctuations and angst-generation, Iggy has not panicked. He has remained calm and Prime Ministerial. Just the guy you want to have running the country, especially in these economic times that are not looking to get any better for a while.

      • Craig Chamberlain says:

        Ignatieff proved himself in this election. That is something Canadians will reflect on.

      • James Curran says:

        I think the point is that some of us do not see any signs of rebranding. We see alienation and self servance and there are no signs of that changing. As Senator Smith says though (on a National Interview no less)…”Hope springs eternal”

  17. MississaugaLibPeter says:

    I will say it now before everyone else does:

    TOMORROW, real proof that Gerard Kennedy (and JT and 1000’s of others) did the right thing in 2006!

    For 5 years he has heard it at the doorstep and whispering folks behind his back. All of us who supported Dion will be vindicated tomorrow. We knew then what is happening now.

    On that note, at the least, every Liberal needs to vote tomorrow.

    If you have time, please help your local campaign – there are 101+ things to do.

    • Michael says:

      You really think that we would be looking at PM Dion???

    • TDotRome says:

      That’s crap. If it weren’t for Kennedy’s foolishness, you probably would have had Rae as leader. Someone who was the most suited for taking on Harper. Also, he would have taken power when he had the chance. Coalition rhetoric be damned. Bob Rae knows that it’s always better to fight from the higher ground….and that’s the PM’s office.

      Even if Iggy had defeated Rae, at least he would have had two more years in the big chair. Two more years of experience under his belt to head into this campaign.

      I like Dion and I like Kennedy, but they screwed up big time.

      • JStanton says:

        bingo. This is exactly the point.


      • MississaugaPeter says:


        Let’s revisit 2006 and the Rae campaign. He was not the right guy – he had just switched over to the Liberals. He had no Liberal credentials. He had almost no ground game, but used technology the way Ford did to achieve incredible results.

        I am not going to bash Rae, and I would have preferred him over Ignatieff in 2006 and 2008/2009. Gerard did go to Bob two days before he packed it in.

        Dion was the best choice at the time (after Gerard of course). If Gerard had not gone to Dion, Iggy would have won (not Rae).

        • James Curran says:

          Gerard’s team was youthful. And so was Dion’s. Neither of them were heading the way of Bob Rae. It was a youth movement aimed at ending the old boys club. That’s just what they did.

  18. Cliff says:

    To be fair to Mr. Ignatieff, what else was he going to say when that question is put to him the day before the election? The question is premised on the Liberals going down in flames tomorrow, which, while a distinct possibility, has yet to happen. The voters could yet surprise us. And now the expectations bar has been set so low that Mr. Ignatieff could easily clear it.

    Even if there is a major setback for the Liberal Party, I would not expect Mr. Ignatieff to announce his intentions right away, given that we may very well be into a period of negotiation among the parties, depending on how the results shake out.

    • The following has been stated already on other threads on this blog, but….the issue facing the LPC is far larger than the suitability of the current leader. Ignatieff gets a strong B+. The larger issue is the leadership culture of the LPC. The paternalism, the elitism, the Toronto-centric smugness all have to go. The grass roots have to have control. No more parachuted candidates. No more “Father Knows Best”. Liberals of all socio-economic levels need to have power. Not just the C-suite crowd.

      • MississaugaPeter says:

        Get Real! Ignatieff gets a B+?

        Where was the effort in dealing with the issue that defined him the past few years?

        Who decided that now was the time to go to the people, in spite of being 10 points behind in the polls? It was Ignatieff, not the LPC.

        Ignatieff, not the LPC, handed the centre-left to the NDP by taking the Liberal Party right of centre (as WK states in his Sun article, Ignatieff is “conservative-lite”).

        Don’t get me wrong, the LPC and the Liberal War Room with Ignatieff failed this election. They did not do their job and need to be replaced. They had Harper as their opponent, they had narratives, they had scandals handed to them, AND THEY FAILED. THE RESULTS DO NOT LIE!

        Even if we stay as the official opposition after tomorrow, ALL THREE FAILED. The Conservatives ran a pathetic campaign, but they are going to do a lot better than our “SUPPOSED good campaign”.

        Let’s say it again, get real!

      • James Curran says:

        Amen Bull. The Toronto centric in this LPC must be addressed immediately.

  19. bruce the painter says:

    Three interesting facts about this election
    1. For a “totally unnecessary election” there seems to be an unusually high level interest
    2. Conrad Black predicts a Conservative/Bloc coalition as the outcome
    3. Jack’s numbers started going up right after that Scottish guy translated for him in the french debate

  20. Bsmith says:

    Gotta say this for Mr. Ignatieff, I am no longer an anyone but the lib’s person anymore. He led a very good campaign, he has set the party up for renewed interest in the next election…sometime in the next 12 months would be my guess. My congrats and gratitude to him.

    • MississaugaPeter says:

      “he has set the party up for renewed interest in the next election”

      Total genius there. Maybe if we became the fourth party he would have set us up for even more renewal!

      Are you in the Liberal War Room or are you getting paid for this?

  21. Jimmy says:

    He was duly elected as leader so he has every right to stay

    errrr …… he WAS elected as leader wasn’t he ? Somehow I don’t see that in the records. Must be an oversight.

  22. james Smith says:

    Great Caesar’s Ghost! Has THIS started already?!
    I remember a party in a Calgary Hotel Suite – think it was 91 & this is the way some folks were ALREADY talking about a Mr C.

  23. Cam says:

    Seems to me the biggest problems with the Federal Liberal Party are, one, the Party eats its own way to quick, and second, those on the inside hold way to many resentments. With a minority government likely coming up it is apparent to me that Ignatieff should stay on. There will be insufficient time to get a new leader ready for the next campaign. Finally, time for all those holding resentments to suck it up, grow up, and all start rowing the boat in the same direction.

    • James Curran says:

      It’s starts with leadership. Iggy has had many an opportunity to be the unifier from within. Instead his henchpeople have alienated many, many of the grassroots. The same grassroots that have shown up for this election inspite of being pissed on. Which is the point here. It is they that have the final say who stays and who goes.

  24. JamesF says:

    Ignatieff should definitely stick around for a little while at least. Look… what happens if (as expected) the Harper Party gets only a plurality of seats? Either things come to a head with the throne speech and another party is asked by the GG to govern, another election happens almost immediately, or the Conservatives truck on with a minority. I would argue that in the first two situations it’s better to go forward with an official (as distinct from an interim) leader and in the third I’d rather not have Liberal abstentions/acquiesces be a foregone conclusion in the midst of a leadership race like last time. And if a leadership race commences immediately what happens then? Leadership camps will pop up and eat up donation money that could otherwise go to the party and when a new leader is chosen we face a fresh wave of jeer-and-smear television ads that the party doesn’t have the financial means to counteract at all and the cycle of the past few years begins anew.

    We need Ignatieff to stick around for at least a year to provide at least potentially stable (again as opposed to strictly interim) leadership for what’s to come and to at least see to it that the party isn’t in financial distress when he does leave. What’s more why all of a sudden did we become the party of one-and-done? Sometimes you have to lose before you can win.

  25. Anne Peterson says:

    As an old social democrat and NDP voter (except if I were living in a riding this election where the liberals might win because I would vote anyway I could to get rid of you know who) I have begun to admire Ignatieff a lot. He is persistent and has learned a lot and seems to like the country and its people a good deal. He has taken it on the chin and remained a decent sort. And why Canadians would want a PM who isn’t extremely smart is beyond me. Don’t agree with his foreign policy necessarily but the domestic one seem intelligent and a for the people kind of thing. And make no mistake when Harper defined Ignatieff he also defined himself and Canadians have NOT been apathetic about his actions, only wondering what to do about it. More than anyone Harper has helped fuel the orange crush train.

  26. Wow! Implosion time for the Liberal Party. I was considering whether to rejoin the Liberal Party to help with the rebuilding efforts, but there is no way in hell I want to touch it if you are all about to pull out the knives. Bunch of twits, you are bickering at the edge of the abbyss.

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