— Musings —03.01.2012 09:11 AM
Vote suppression: Tea Party North was doing it too
Liberal and NDP politicians in Ontario say some of the alleged dirty tricks used in the federal election also surfaced in last fall’s provincial campaign.
Just like the federal contest, Ontario’s election featured automated calling machines with messages directed at voters.
Several Ontario candidates say there were messages designed to mislead voters — although none that said their polling station had been changed at the last minute, as is alleged in the federal vote.
Ontario Liberals, who were reduced to a minority government, say they were targeted in several ridings with so-called robocalls to voters suggesting they were going to set up a provincial gun registry as the federal registry was wound down.
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1975…BC provincial election…election day…16 year old son of the owner of a mom ‘n’ pop grocery store…told me and rest of his classmates that his Dad had received a phone call the previous evening telling him that if Dave Barrett were re elected he was going to nationalize all mom ‘n’ pop grocery stores in BC.
Technology has advanced, they can call more people than ever, but the content sounds about the same.
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You forgot to ask him if Kennedy was his hero Gord
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Very likely…altho, I have no hard evidence of that. Even on something like a message board/blog we get comment attributed to one person, when, in fact that one name is a group of people. Our information age is moving quickly and it is sometimes hard to differentiate between what is straight up from another citizen, and what is false propaganda.
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Just keep denying and pretending the CPC and the CPO have any principles whatsoever. It may be difficult to prove the letter of the law was broken but there is no doubt in anyone’s mind, except the most devout Conservative supporters, that breaking the spirit of the law and of democracy is standard operating procedure for these people.
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Unless you have proof they are making it up you are also making it up.
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A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It’s a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it’s because it’s proven. 😉
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My God, I love that man.
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Prove it.
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Whoever taught you Gord did a poor job.
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Regardless, unless you have proof of your statement you are also making it up
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Nice spinning Gord. You respond to the point with a point (regardless of what semantics you use) and your point is not backed up by anything thus rendering your point as invalid as the one that you attempt to invalidate.
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“Unless they have recordings and phone time stamps and numbers thu are making it up. And now the fraud is on the othe party.”
That is a statement Gord, not a request. A statement which you havent backed up and refuse to back up by continued spinning. You claim that the fraud is on the other party yet do not provide anything to back that up.
That is not a request Gord, that is a statement and an unfounded one.
Do try to keep up
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Why do you keep making accusations you cannot prove, Mr. Tulk? It’s just wrong.
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Gordon Tulk,
What will you say to the troops in another country right now bringing democracy at such a high cost? Will you tell them they are there for a new Conservative democracy? Modeled off a Qaddafi democracy, or a Syrian democracy? Will you stand up and proudly admit to supporting this new-found Canadian democracy? I have only one more question sir. Have you no shame sir? Have you no shame?
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Requiring photo ID to vote is a very well known voter suppression technique that has been growing in the US for some time now. Rather bold to suggest using one scam as the solution to another.
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There is no such thing as a free piece of photo ID, which means there would be no such thing as a vote that was free to every citizen.
Creating a requirement that we already know many marginalized people currently can’t fulfill is the same as taking away their right to vote.
Strange how only the republicans want voter photo ID laws. If it were such a good idea, maybe the ACLU would support it too.
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I was not aware that there is a high incidence of people with non-Canadian citizenship with phone bills voting in elections? Were the phone bills from Iran, Russia, the US?
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They put ink on your finger after voting in Afghanistan or Iraq, not in Canada. But of course after a period of Conservative Government, the difference between Canada and those countries might be negligible.
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Well if that were true then the doctored military records of Bush wouldn’t have been detected. The thing is when you do a composite image using photoshop or Gimp or any other type of image software, you do leave a sort of footprint even if you cannot see it at high resolutions. Creating a bill like you claim requires someone with professional abilities, not your typical campaign volunteer or party member.
You know insurance, I know Photoshop. The difference is I dont make claims of knowing insurance.
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Gord, is there anything that the Conservatives could do that you wouldn’t defend other than govern to the left of center? Hopefully he doesn’t ask you to drink the Kool Aid.
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Speaking of “unreported crimes” ………………
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Stockwell Day may have known more than he was saying at the time. 😉
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Ah the old Tulk technique of challenge with a strawman ethical question and a generalization of a swath of people with no proof. Nice try but it really hasnt worked for you for ages.
Tulkfail1.0
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Which you dispute with anecdote or uncited “facts”. A strawman is a strawman Gord.
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Wikipedia again Gord. Why not try to find a source that is accepted as valid in Canadian high schools instead of a community managed encyclopedia that is prone to tampering.
Allow me to rephrase my point since you are so inflexible. You are once again trying to manipulate the argument in your favour not by providing a valid point but countering with a loaded ethical question and generalization.
That really isnt debate Gord, its being unable to defend your view without relying on cheap games.
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In any case, verifying whether the calls occurred should be a fairly simple matter of checking phone records as the date, time and incoming call number are indicated. Then tracking the origin of the incoming call should be substantially easier to pinpoint unless we see more painstaking efforts to prevent the identity of the originator from being determined, maybe more burner cell phones, pseudonyms and other fraudulent activities. Fraud committed for the sake of more fraud.
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Abusive calls aren’t pleasant, but they’re irrelevant, legally. The CEA deals with the dissemination of false and misleading info. Not hurt feelings.
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I’m sure there are. But they’re legally irrelevant. I’m surprised you are preoccupied with the hurt feelings of Liberals and New Democrats.
What matters, as I am certain you are aware, is actual fraud. I have provided evidence of just one such case. There will be more.
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Exactly.
We have to drop our own concern over the many abusive calls made by Conservatives over the last several elections.
It distracts from the focus on actual illegal activity and election fraud.
And it makes us look like the poor losers and whiners that Harper is trying to frame this whole issue around.
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Sure, when Niki Ashton beat Tina Keeper there was a systematic program of informing natives (in areas that were pro Keeper) that under the new laws people had to go to Winnipeg to vote. That same election I talked to people in St Catherines who came home from voting to find a letter on Elections Canada letter head telling them not to go to the polling station they had just come from.
I respect Elections Canada, they try to do a good job but they are under resourced and have very little investigative power. In the end the Conservatives got off on in and out for that reason, they could out spend EC on fighting it so EC took some instead of risking losing the whole thing.
This is why we need a independent prosecuter, the RCMP is so far up Harpers ass and EC is underresourced.
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Sherlock Tulk is on the case! Muddying the waters from his secret location!
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Wow. Gord are you paid to write all these responses?
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Why should I do the heavy lifting? That wouldnt make it easy for Sherlock Tulk.
I thought you were “in the know”?
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As for calling the RCMP, let’s not forget the ultimately false allegations against Finance Minister Ralph Goodale made public by the RCMP just prior to the 2006 Election. It had a definite impact on Liberal numbers and handed the election to Harper.
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I’ve seen these dirty tricks in other ways for years. 1984 Federal Election in Rural Alberta, I would put up signs until 8-9 pm & jerks would play chicken with me in their pick-ups. When I was on the road to Calgary- each morning at 6am, EVERY single Grit sign was gone, not knocked down but taken away. Every election jerks knock down signs, but CONSERVATIVES STEAL SIGNS – I managed a Provincial campaign in the 905 in 1999, & got an angry call from a fella who’s back yard was a dumping ground for at least 200 large coroplast Grit signs and a handful of Dipper ones.
In 1988 federal election, a young so called volunteer helped with the candidate canvas, funny thing, when canvasing on her own, she never left flyers, & the polls she was in with the candidate, we did not get the kind of result we did in other candidate canvased polls. When she didn’t show up near the end of the campaign we started to wondered how she could take so much time from her day job, we later found out her job was working in the office of the local Tory MPP.
Rather than get agitated, I’ve always advised people to call the returning office about the worst, & have also spoken to my fair share of Tory campaign mangers. I understand people want to win, but at what cost? I’ve come to the conclusion that many, check that- most people are attracted to the Conservative cause as active volunteers & in paid positions is because they have no scruples & will stop at nothing for their dogma – democracy be damned. I think it is time for all fair minded Canadians to get pissed off & send these people to the wood shed for a generation – or more.
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It is incorrect to say they are making it up just because they are not providing “proof”. Instead, they are making an allegation, unproven though it may be. “Making it up” suggests a lie and that requires that a) it be false and b) there is intent that it is false.
You don’t know they are making it up. You only know the allegation is unproven. For you to say “they are making it up” suggests you have proof that they are lying. Otherwise, making it up” is just an unproven allegation.
So which is it, are you making an uproven allegation or do you have proof that this is a lie?
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You never provide valid citation for your arguments other than opinion columns and wikipedia (both of which are not valid sources). Does this mean that your points are invalid?
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Gord You’re a cowaard. There might be a member of the armed forces reading this now. What do you say to them? Answer the question Tulk instead of pretending it’s a joke.
You seem to be morally compromised.
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It looks more like he’s attacking your integrity Gord.
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not much of an indicator, since over half of them are yours. My point is how many decent people are being turned off this blog by your ubiquitous drivel
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Im more curious as to how many people have opted not to use Tulk for insurance after googling him.
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If he were anywhere but rural central Alberta, quite a few. His shtick wouldn’t fly in too many other places.
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No, I think he is Warren’s evil twin. He is the Joker to his Bat-Man. Ali to his Frazier. Ying, yang and all that.
I probably only agree with 50% of what Gord says, but I do enjoy reading everyone’s responses to him here.
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Kevin Gaudet and the PCs in Pickering Scarborough East did a mass mailing after the media blackout the day before the election saying that the Liberal candidate was bringing a coal fired generator to our riding. They still lost but even my 9 year old daughter thought that was dirty – typical Hudak PC behaviour.