06.04.2014 02:19 PM

The Ontario debate winner!

This guy could’ve won last night’s #onpoli debate. Doesn’t sweat, doesn’t wave arms, doesn’t use cue cards.




  1. Emil E says:

    Forget the debate because the election result may already be locked in for the Wynne Liberals!

    John Ivison: Liberals clearly the ‘party of choice’ for OPPA — despite what union president says

    John Ivison | June 4, 2014 | Jun 4 5:13 PM ET

    The Ontario Provincial Police union claimed its “anyone but Tim Hudak” ads were not an endorsement of the Liberals or NDP.

    But the transcript of a discussion held by OPPA executives tells a different story. As part of the online discussion, Jim Christie, the OPPA’s president, says a Liberal majority would be “the best case scenario” for the union.

    “We have been working this angle hard enough. I am meeting with their leadership tonight,” the transcript of the May 26 call credits him as saying.

    More at: http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/06/04/john-ivison-liberals-clearly-the-party-of-choice-for-oppa-despite-what-union-president-says/

    Okay, let’s stop kidding ourselves; the OPPA has provided the clarion call for all the Public Service union workers to vote Liberal, and that means NDP supporters must vote strategically for the Wynne Liberals.

    If this is successful, and I believe it will be, then there will be a majority Wynne Liberal government voted in by 1.2 million PS workers…. the the rest of Ontario can go to hell!

    • Matt says:

      And this surprises you?

      Karl Walsh, an executive with the OPPA ran for the Liberals in 2011.

    • Matt says:

      Plus you need to ask yourself how Ivison got his hands on internal OPPA transcripts.

      Obviously not everyone in the OPPA is happy with the executives decision to get involved in the election.

      • Matt says:

        To my point:

        Transcript shows not all OPP union execs backed Hudak attack ads


        • Emil E says:

          Now OPSEU have come out with their direct attack against the PCs with their “Tim Hudak’s Plan B” website and video, here:


          Looks like the unions are starting to pile on against Hudak and the PCs. Wonder if this will create a backlash amongst the general population.

          • Matt says:

            OPSEU leader Smoket Thomas is just pissed Hudak has started using his own words against him. In 2012, Thomas said there were at least 60,000 surplus management positions in Ontarios public sector.

            And today the Professional Firefighters Union piled on. But here’s the funny thing – They had to get the head of the INTERNATIONAL firefighters union in WASHINGTON DC to write the letter for their Ontario members.

            Hmmmmm. An American getting involved in an anti Hudak campaign. That just might go against Elections Ontario rules.

    • Just askin' says:

      If the rest of Ontario likes seeing police officers get ridiculous amounts of money working paid duty gigs at which they intimidate people into giving them freebies, likes seeing police officers push around protesters and likes seeing officers shoot mentally ill people and get away with it, you’re right.

      If the rest of Ontario is tired of the above, you’re wrong.

      • Emil E says:

        I heard that a 3 year veteran OPP officer earns ~$90,000 p.a.! Okay, so they may be worth it based on their education, training and experience, but to continue getting huge annual increases based on negotiated labour contracts is not appropriate nor fair to the average Ontarian struggling to survive. Then there is public service pensions which are incredibly rich! Have things got out of proportion in Ontario and Canada?

        • TrueNorthist says:

          Right. As the incidents in Moncton demonstrate most terribly, these supposedly over-payed officers put their very lives on the line every moment they show up for duty. I’m thinking you might come to regret your words today.

  2. MississaugaPeter says:

    Nothing better than politicians buying votes with deficit dollars. In this case, the Liberals buying off the civil servants with our children’s paycheques.

    But the Liberals are not the first nor will they be the last to do that or benefit from it. In the U.S. the top 1% are protected, at the expense of American children’s and unborn children’s paycheques.

    It is just sad thinking that $10B of taxes collected every year by our provincial government goes to paying off debt (and absolutely no principle) because politicians are not required to be fiscal managers like they were pre-Trudeau and pre-Nixon.

    It is just sad hearing that it is o.k. because we are not in the same boat as Greece. At $12B-$15B annual deficits, it will not be long before we are.


    According to The Toronto Sun, we may already be in worse shape than Greece.

    • Emil E says:

      The public service union workers are at the top of the totem pole in Ontario and they will fight to retain their advantageous position regardless of the economic situation of Ontario. It’s called self-interest and it trumps all political principles.

      Ontario is in worse economic shape than California. Read this and shudder!:

      Ont. compared to cash-strapped Calif.

      It’s a 2012 article when McGuinty was still Premier, but you can safely assume that the situation has deteriorated since then!

  3. Kelly says:

    Cops in this country are developing a very bad habit of inserting themselves in elections. Banana republic stuff.

    Don’t get me wrong, Hudak would be disaster for the whole country as his crazy voodoo economics will make most of us poorer, as has happened in the USA and Britain., but cops and elections don’t mix.

    • Emil E says:

      Perhaps a Hudak PC government is exactly the economic enema that the Ontario public service needs to unclog and sweep out the detritus that provides services of little to no value to the beleaguered taxpayer. Now it remains to be seen if Ontario voters will get overwhelmed by special interest groups maintaining the status quo. Ontario economy needs fixing up and the Lib-Dip axis ain’t gonna get the job done. Is Ontario ready to swallow the PC medicine or will they continue in their chronic state?

      • Kelly says:

        Cutting taxes to balance the budget is like quitting your job to pay your mortgage. It doesn’t work and is nonsensical even on the surface. Giving tax cuts to profitable companies doesn’t improve productivity — it lowers it. Hudak will give owners a raise for doing nothing ; they’ll be able to work LESS and take home more. We need an extra bracket on really high incomes (over $150k) and turn it over directly to low income families as a top up. They’ll spend it locally on goods and services and on tools to help them get ahead instead of socking it away off shore or trips abroad or exotic foreign made cars. A good affordable daycare program would get more people into the workforce and increase the labor force participation rate and reduce risks for some folks and help people take a chance on starting a new business too.

        As for the useless programs you abhor…tell me … Are cuts to education smarter that freeing up take home pay to spend on trinkets for wealthy people? That’s Hudak’s plan in a nutshell. It’s based on economic illiteracy.

        • Matt says:

          Hudak has not said he would cut taxes to balance the budget.

          He said he would cut personal income taxes 10% AFTER the deficit is eliminated.

          He has also said he would cut business taxes now to try and spur job creation. Whether these cuts work to create jobs is something that can be debated.

        • Matt says:

          You can honestly sit there and think the increased spending on “education” by the Liberals actually made it to the kids?

          It went to teachers salaries, benefits and pensions while the kids are still using 20 or 30 year old text books.

  4. e.a.f. says:

    o.k. the “guy” in the picture is better looking than the 3 candidates and maybe more friendly. I’d vote for him.

  5. Al in Cranbrook says:

    The assumption that 1.2 million union members all vote the same way, or at least left of center, is simplistic logic.

    F’rinstance, close friends of ours: She’s belonged to a big BC union, goes with the job she got several years back. About a dozen years work experience prior, no unions. Bottom line it, sparing everyone the ridiculous details, if dues were voluntary, she wouldn’t give ’em ten cents. And she can’t wait for full disclosure legislation to pass.

    Next up for them, the BCTF is on rotating strike action. Over last year, teachers even sent union literature home with their 8 year old. They’re so fed up with all of it, they’re going to pull their daughter out of the public school system, and enroll her in the Catholic school, happily paying the $200/mo. it will cost them. During the interview they mentioned that their kid has substitute teachers about 15 times this last year. The principal replied that over the last year the Catholic school had used the services of a substitute teacher exactly once. The kicker? The both of them are atheist, which the principal noted is quite common these days among those attending their school.

    One state…Wisonsin?…a couple years back legislated that public sector union dues henceforth would be voluntarily paid directly, no longer deducted from pay cheques. Within one year union membership dropped by 90%.

    Point being: The notion that all members are committed to their union and its dictates is fantasy.

    • Emil E says:

      Sorry, Al, but you don’t know Ontario. The McGuinty Liberals were able to stay in power solely based on the Toronto, the GTA vote and that’s where the concentration of public service workers reside. The rest of Ontario pretty much went PC and NDP with only a smattering going Liberal!

      Now that Hudak has disturbed the PS hornet nest with his 100,000 job chop, you can bet the PS union vote will flock to Wynne Liberals to Stop Hudak! Of course Hudak knows that he will never win the PS vote, his attack on them is intended to rally disadvantage Ontarians to his side. His only hope is that the PS vote will be split or it will stay home but I doubt that will happen. I’m looking at a majority Wynne government because the PS vote will flee the NDP and flow to the Wynne Liberals.

      • Al in Cranbrook says:


        Guess I’ve talked to too many people in my 60 year life time who experienced the likes of the “Stasi” first hand. And I’ve read too much history about all of it, including intelligence and counter-intelligence services. Certainly enough to be annoyed by those who loosely toss such references around for the sake of making specious, and all too often uninformed, debating points.

        Ironically (generously speaking), a lot of the same folks who make (trite) comparisons to Naziism, fascism, and the like, in the next breath will advocate disarming of the citizenry…which is about as close to creating such a state as it possibly gets; indeed it is the first prerequisite of establishing tyranny. Again, I draw upon having talked to too many who experienced such laws first hand.

        I’m not going to get into the rest of it, far too complicated a topic to get wrapped up in here.

  6. Al in Cranbrook says:

    Sounds like the OPPA is going to have the riot act spelled out for them in no uncertain terms…


  7. Matt says:

    Is there no level to which the Liberals won’t stoop to win this election?


    For over a year the Wynne Liberals have denied coverage of the drugs tis little girl needs to live.

    Now, during an election, and a day after Wynne loses the leaders debate, they ride in on their white horse and say the will fund the drug.


    • MississaugaPeter says:

      Bribing the municipalities this morning. It is just so much desperation to stay in power. Living in one of the gas plant ridings that turned red, I can vouch that it works. Then each $1B extra deficit becomes $2B after 20 years of interest payments. But who cares, maintaining power now is all that matters.

    • sezme says:

      Yes, shame on the Liberals for paying for this girl’s drugs during an election campaign. If they had any principles at all, they would have let her die.

      I’m sure we can look forward to the PCs paying for every drug out there. Can’t wait.

      • MississaugaPeter says:

        Pretty dramatic … they would have let her die.

        Is that what Wynne and Matthews have been doing for close to a year?

        • Warren says:

          Hearing Matthews is a goner.

          • MississaugaPeter says:

            London, Ontario, is experiencing a downturn and I think Matthews and the Liberals will be, rightly or not, the scapegoats for this.

            I thought things were going to get clearer after the debates, but they haven’t. As I replied here weeks ago, my union leader neighbour said they were going to take a wait position before deciding to support Wynne or Horwath. It seems they have chosen to follow Wynne.

            You posted earlier that the NDP were short on funds. Sad to hear that. I believe the NDP will have their best results ever here in Peel, although, maybe not enough for more than 1 seat.

          • Matt says:

            NDP or PC going to take the seat?

      • Matt says:

        PC MPP Christine Elliot has been fighting to get this girl’s drug covered from the beginning.

        Nice try though

    • Michael says:

      Those dastardly Liberals. How dare they pay for drugs to make a little girl’s life better. And how dare they negotiate with a drug company so it is more affordable for our healthcare system. What is next? Will they hire nurses and open hospitals? Will they improve test and graduation rates? Will they stop at nothing to get re-elected?

      Sorry Matt if your tin foil hat is on a little too tight. But there were multiple provinces, led by Alberta, negotiating with the drug company to lower the cost of the cystic fibrosis drug. I suppose it is always possible that the Ontario Liberals have infiltrated the Alberta PCs and timed negotiation to conclude after the Ontario leaders debate.

      • MississaugaPeter says:


        No one is suggesting that it was not the right thing to do.

        They are suggesting that it is crap for Wynne/Matthews to say no for almost a year and then approve it and act like heros one week before the vote.

        If Alberta had not done the hard work, would we have had an announcement, and would a young girl and family have had to perpetually fundraise to make her life bearable?

  8. Patrick says:

    It will be interesting to see if this announcement has any impact on seats in Ottawa http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/0606-elxn-lrt

    Everyone is talking about more subway lines for the GTA but funding for the next phase of light rail in Ottawa has already been rejected by one leader. I know we don’t have enough seats in the area to make a difference in the election but it seems hypocritical to be promoting more subway lines for the GTA while saying the province cannot afford to contribute to the next phase in Ottawa

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